Professional speaker, documentary producer, writer and singer it he bands TRIAL and BETWEEN EARTH& SKY, Greg Bennick is by far one of the most influential figures in hardcore in the past 15 years, and was nice enough to take some time off his busy schedule to answer some questions for us.
1. It’s been more than 15 years since Trial started, how do you see yourself now? How much did you and the band change in these years?
GREG: I see myself largely the same as I did when the band was really picking up speed. There was a definite shift in the band between the sort of pre-Trial line up with the first two records, where the personnel of the band and the songs we were creating were simply hardcore songs with intent of communicating potent feelings and ideas, and then the "Are These Our Lives?" era when the lineup solidified and the songs got way more intense and powerful. Three members quit permanently to play metal instead of hardcore, and that left Timm and I able to find people who wanted to take the band to another level communicatively. Of course that all changed in 2009 with the death of Brian Redman our beloved bassist, and it was only in the last few months that we've found our stride again in terms of feeling connected to one another once again as a group and about the ideas and feelings we're sharing.
2. You took a long break and then played just a few shows for almost ten years, but now you are back with a month long European tour. Was it hard for you to get back on the road? GREG: It wasn't difficult to get back out and play shows again, with the exception of overcoming the immense hurdle that was the loss of Brian from our lives. We all had an agreement after the first show back at Rainfest: if it hurt too much, the band was over forever. And it hurt a lot. Playing without Brian was completely upsetting, but at the same time, the passion brought to the band by new bassist Roger Kilburn and the fun, intelligence, and craziness he exudes offstage mirrored at least for me the essence of what we'd lost with Brian. Of course Brian could never be replaced, but the feeling that we have now isn't night and day different from what we had before. Its just different, but its a "different" that feels good in its own right.
3. How was the tour with Anchor and Run With The Hunted?
GREG: The tour with Anchor and Run with the Hunted was one of the greatest experiences of my life. Thirty shows in total, with four on our own in Ukraine and Russia, and all potent in one way or another. There is video of the first song from the Ukraine show here: http://tinyurl.com/trialukraine. I am writing a book about the tour right now and am about 50 pages into it. It will come out on Words As Weapons which is a website I started fifteen years ago and have done little with. I will post updates at wordsasweapons.com. All profits from the book will benefit One Hundred For Haiti (http://www.onehundredforhaiti.org)
4. How do you see the European scene compared to the one in the US?
GREG: They are structurally and functionally the same, especially in the west of Europe, where the hardcore scene has basically the same feel and look as the United States. It feels like a carbon copy at times, which is very strange, especialy in a subculture that values individuality. The scene differences really begin to show in the east. In Ukraine and Russia and Macedonia, Bulgaria, Romania, and places like that, there is a sense of the hardcore scene being completely about passion and heart. It shows in the variety of people at the shows, the way people dance and move, and the way they connect after the shows. They don't seem to take anything for granted.
5. Trial remains one of the more “political” bands in hardcore. How do you see the relation between hardcore and politics now that most bands tend to be less radical in their ideas? GREG: I see it this way: hardcore will not save you, it is not the end of the revolution, and in fact is only the beginning, or at most one "voice" of a collective of revolutionary thinking / response to the world....but none of that means that a better alternative is to be apolitical. Hardcore and politics or at the very least hardcore and social awareness and critique go together hand in hand. Bands with nothing to say in hardcore are wasting their listener's time. They would be better suited to play less beats per minute, start dressing better, and try to make it as radio rock bands and save us all the time spent hoping for more from them. And it doesn't have to be "radical", as long as it has ideas and meaning behind it. Anything other than just screaming for the sake of screaming.
6. Animal rights was a big topic in hardcore in the 90s. Is it still relevant for you as a band? GREG: Animal rights was never a primary topic for Trial. When we formed, there were many bands doing it better, meaning covering that topic in such detail, that the world didn't need another Earth Crisis doing the same thing. Our song "Cycle of Cruelty" was about human rights, but it touched on the rights of all things to live and exist in the world. We support the SHAC campaign to shut down Huntingdon Life Sciences, and those who have been wrongfully imprisoned during it. The ideals are important to us, even if we don't sing about them directly in our lyrics. More important is the idea of constantly adapting and changing tactically in the face of political or social struggle, which is what the song "War By Other Means" is about.
7. You’ve pointed out that the most important thing is to take these ideals outside the concert room and into our everyday life. Do you think that this scene has the potential to be a real force of change? Do you sometimes feel like you’re preaching to the choir?
GREG: Hardcore is ALWAYS a real force of change as long as people connect to is, understand it, and feel it. The passion in hardcore is a passion that is often rare in day to day life outside of this type of music. So when we bring that passion to the world we have the potential to change lives if we are willing to take on the challenge that this immense responsibility presents. There are always people willing to hear new ideas in new ways or old ideas with new ears. And for that reason, the 'preaching to the choir' critique that people often toss around doesn't have any weight behind it. Its an easy excuse for people who aren't creative with their words and ideas: "Oh...sharing ideas in hardcore is just preaching to the choir". That should be translated as "I am too uncreative to think of ideas on my own and I don't want to copy what (insert person/band here) says, so I will instead just pretend that to speak out is just a waste of time." People who bring this specific critique should be ignored.
GREG: Hardcore is ALWAYS a real force of change as long as people connect to is, understand it, and feel it. The passion in hardcore is a passion that is often rare in day to day life outside of this type of music. So when we bring that passion to the world we have the potential to change lives if we are willing to take on the challenge that this immense responsibility presents. There are always people willing to hear new ideas in new ways or old ideas with new ears. And for that reason, the 'preaching to the choir' critique that people often toss around doesn't have any weight behind it. Its an easy excuse for people who aren't creative with their words and ideas: "Oh...sharing ideas in hardcore is just preaching to the choir". That should be translated as "I am too uncreative to think of ideas on my own and I don't want to copy what (insert person/band here) says, so I will instead just pretend that to speak out is just a waste of time." People who bring this specific critique should be ignored.
8. You got involved with the Hardcore Help Foundation, can you tell us more about that? GREG: Absolutely...HHF were the promoters and sponsors for the first Trial show of the tour in Monchengladbach Germany. They are an incredible group of people who have decided to harness the power of hardcore to help people in need by doing a series of benefit shows and different fundraisers and then applying the money they raise to different projects around the world. They will be working with One Hundred For Haiti and we are honored that they are putting their energy into what we have going on. Everyone should find out more about them and get involved with what they are doing! Especially bands and labels. Find out more at http://hardcore-help.com/
9. Your documentary “Flight from Death” deals with the relation between humans and their own mortality. In your other band, Between Earth & Sky, you seem to tackle the same subjects, can you say a few words about it for those who aren’t familiar with it?
GREG: Yes...happy to. The basic idea is that humans fear death on a subconscious level and that we use reason and creativity and intellect to try to rationalize our way out of the eventual death that we all face. The problem comes in that we collectively agree on social structures that feel true to us: religion, family, finance, etc...and these things soothe our fears about dying. Its as if something of us will survive even if we ourselves perish. The problem is: what happens when these truths that sustain us come up against contrary truths from another culture or group of people? Its like immortality systems are colliding. Given that our psychological sense of self and our basis for calm come from our truths being "true", when different systems collide, it causes us to want to absorb, destroy, or integrate these other viewpoints. This is what our film is about: http://www.flightfromdeath.com.
GREG: Yes...happy to. The basic idea is that humans fear death on a subconscious level and that we use reason and creativity and intellect to try to rationalize our way out of the eventual death that we all face. The problem comes in that we collectively agree on social structures that feel true to us: religion, family, finance, etc...and these things soothe our fears about dying. Its as if something of us will survive even if we ourselves perish. The problem is: what happens when these truths that sustain us come up against contrary truths from another culture or group of people? Its like immortality systems are colliding. Given that our psychological sense of self and our basis for calm come from our truths being "true", when different systems collide, it causes us to want to absorb, destroy, or integrate these other viewpoints. This is what our film is about: http://www.flightfromdeath.com.
10. How do you see the world now? Everyone seems to be more or less in the gutter, but things aren’t changing that much.
GREG: The world is gorgeous and flawed and constantly in need of adjustment and care. Not everyone is in the gutter. Many are, but many have the resources and energy to help them and to keep them alive and to improve their lives. If things aren't changing that much, change them. Take Haiti for example: I started One Hundred For Haiti because I wanted to see more change. I am .000000001% of the work being done in Haiti and even that estimate is too generous. But its still something. You can do something too. Pick a target and focus on it and get something done for someone else somewhere.
11. What do you thing about the recent “Occupy the World” wave of protests?
GREG: Incredible...and picking up steam as we are in the midst of this interview. Rome just exploded a couple weeks ago, and NYC the other night. People are pissed off and rightly so. Its the little things that infuriate, and the big things that demolish our spirit. People have little hope, and the people too poor to even worry about hope are in our sights. The irresponsible of the world are being called to responsibility, as are those who are self-serving and selfish and absorbed in the trivial. These people need to be focused on like targets, and through pinpointed and relentless action, have their world re-adjusted, in my humble opinion. Lets start with stable housing and health care for all. Lets start with corporate accountibility and taxation, or if they refuse, no taxation for the rest of us either. Let's prioritize youth and the elderly so that children can be fed instead of dying hungry, and once fed, educated so that the future is brighter...and in terms of the elderly, lets create lives for them that are not dependent on a trickle of social welfare, but a priority in our society that places them and their experience and wisdom as more important than it currently is: case in point, the fact that so many elderly people are hungry and forgotten socially. Lets consider the effect of nation-state politics and the effect on defense, lack of trust, and subsequent profit. Lets consider capitalism out of control as it is currently and how it will eventually destroy itself and everyone along with it. Overall my hope is that the protests continue to find focus and direction. And the problem is exactly what I demonstrated here with my own multi-issue plan: for the protests to be effective they need a focused point and plan of attack. Attacking too many issues will dilute their strength.
GREG: Incredible...and picking up steam as we are in the midst of this interview. Rome just exploded a couple weeks ago, and NYC the other night. People are pissed off and rightly so. Its the little things that infuriate, and the big things that demolish our spirit. People have little hope, and the people too poor to even worry about hope are in our sights. The irresponsible of the world are being called to responsibility, as are those who are self-serving and selfish and absorbed in the trivial. These people need to be focused on like targets, and through pinpointed and relentless action, have their world re-adjusted, in my humble opinion. Lets start with stable housing and health care for all. Lets start with corporate accountibility and taxation, or if they refuse, no taxation for the rest of us either. Let's prioritize youth and the elderly so that children can be fed instead of dying hungry, and once fed, educated so that the future is brighter...and in terms of the elderly, lets create lives for them that are not dependent on a trickle of social welfare, but a priority in our society that places them and their experience and wisdom as more important than it currently is: case in point, the fact that so many elderly people are hungry and forgotten socially. Lets consider the effect of nation-state politics and the effect on defense, lack of trust, and subsequent profit. Lets consider capitalism out of control as it is currently and how it will eventually destroy itself and everyone along with it. Overall my hope is that the protests continue to find focus and direction. And the problem is exactly what I demonstrated here with my own multi-issue plan: for the protests to be effective they need a focused point and plan of attack. Attacking too many issues will dilute their strength.
12. Recommend some authors/books that complement the ideals that Trial stands for.
GREG: Everyone should read the original graphic novel for V For Vendetta by Alan Moore, along with A People's History of the United States by Howard Zinn, and anything by Noam Chomsky. I also of course have been a long time fan of, and inspired deeply by, the work of Ernest Becker who wrote The Denial of Death and Escape From Evil among other books. His approach to sociology has been profound for me and has deeply influenced my thinking and lyric writing, especially in Between Earth & Sky.
GREG: Everyone should read the original graphic novel for V For Vendetta by Alan Moore, along with A People's History of the United States by Howard Zinn, and anything by Noam Chomsky. I also of course have been a long time fan of, and inspired deeply by, the work of Ernest Becker who wrote The Denial of Death and Escape From Evil among other books. His approach to sociology has been profound for me and has deeply influenced my thinking and lyric writing, especially in Between Earth & Sky.
13. What are your future plans with Trial and Between Earth & Sky?
GREG: For Trial, I think we all would like some time with family, friends, and just to be at home for a month or two or three. After that, I am open to any touring opportunity. As for Between Earth & Sky, we have three songs written for an LP, and will write about fifteen more and then record next year, followed by a Euro/Ukraine/Russian tour hopefully. We'll post updates on facebook and at http://www.betweenearthandsky.com.
14. Thank you so much for taking the time to answer to our questions. I hope we get to see you again someday. All the best!
GREG: Thank YOU for the interview and for taking the time to ask me about my thoughts on all these things. People should feel free to be in touch anytime: http://www.facebook.com/gregbennick. I look forward to hearing from you.
http://www.onehundredforhaiti.org
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